Bootleg figurines – Customer or seller's fault?

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Which one is the real one?

I was chatting with Blurmage on IRC when he mentioned about getting a counterfeit nendoroid in the EOY convention held a few weeks ago. When he actually posted this news on SGCafe to get the views and warn others about this situation, I was appalled to see many comments ridiculing him about his stupidity. They were laughing, insulting and stating that it’s his fault for purchasing a fake figurine, while happily condoning the fact that A FAKE FIGURINE is actually sold in a prestigious convention such as EOY. Let me add that I do not think Blurmage is devoid of all blame. As a buyer, he could have been more informed about the situation, and as many have said in the thread, take this as a painful lesson to know that there are counterfeit stuff.

However, we see comments such as this on a popular Singaporean forum, SGcafe. Sometimes, I feel embarrassed that I am a Singaporean when we have forum users writing in such juvenile language.

They do sadly , I mean , I dun blame PITB , their service is flawless , and not only tat , most SG peeps are cheapskates who just want all the good stuff , even if they are fakes XD Majority of PSP users (Inclusive of myself) Don’t even have a UMD XD

 

Let me give a scenario. McDonalds accidentally sold some pork on the menu when it is supposed to be Halal. Obviously, McDonalds did not know about this, but it still happened. Muslims are offended because they ate the meat unknowingly and only realized when they consumed the food. Can a plea of ignorance clear McDonalds from any wrong doing? NO WAY. In fact, criminal law usually considers a plea of ignorance to be a rare case because it usually discredits the whole notion of responsibility of a seller. If you would say anything disagreeing about this point of view, I would love to see if it makes sense. I am probably lacking in the ability to understand the logic that goes against the above scenario. I do not deny that the example is not exactly the scenario that Blurmage, but the allegations seemed to hint that the distributor’s ignorance clears them of all sin.

I feel almost insulted and embarrassed to share the Internet with people of retarded behavior and trolling abilities that fail very badly. If you want to troll, please do it in an intelligent manner so that it feels like you actually have a brain. Anyway, before you can say anything, good work Anonymous. You have done a good job.

P.s: Blurmage, you should really just talk to the distributor, ask for a possible refund, and close the issue. Ignore the retards in the thread please.

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24 Comments

  1. Posted December 28, 2008 at 10:51 am | Permalink

    Seriously I’m really amazed by some of the replies on supporting piracy. It’s just like the replies I see during the Odex dorama. In some ways they do not see the true problems that lies within. I don’t feel insulted really, I feel better that I can read better than many of them even tho I had an E8 for English for my ‘O’ level.

    Maybe my line on wanting to bring the issue up to CASE just baited them for the the epic replies. Oh well. :3

  2. Posted December 28, 2008 at 11:49 am | Permalink

    Now I feel bad for informing him his figure was fake. It actually doesn’t look too bad and it’s hard to look for the signs of a fake if it’s not on your mind to think about looking for fakes at a prestigious con.

  3. Cat Megex
    Posted December 28, 2008 at 11:54 am | Permalink

    So, uh…I’m assuming that the one on the left is the real one, as the one on the right is labeled as “Miku Hatsune” when in fact being Hachune?

  4. Cat Megex
    Posted December 28, 2008 at 11:54 am | Permalink

    :P

  5. Posted December 28, 2008 at 11:59 am | Permalink

    Wow, that’s really unfortunate. I think the best thing that can happen in such a scenario is for the seller to take responsibility and refund the customer even if s/he honestly didn’t know. It’s part of being a seller to learn about these sorts of things when buying from manufacturers, etc. It’s really no one’s fault but the bootleggers (or if you really wanna reach, the economy that put the bootleggers in their situation), so there’s really no ideal solution. D:

  6. Posted December 28, 2008 at 12:59 pm | Permalink

    come on now, anyone would be fooled by that. what’s to say the seller was even aware he was selling bootlegs.
    that aside, imbeciles like that are aplenty in forums and blogs, it’s why we have moderators to begin with. their opinion is a reflection of how insensitive some netizens can be towards those in plight.if the victim in question was looking to heighten awareness of bootlegs to the singapore community by posting about it on sgcafe, the effort was for naught. to them,it just makes for a good read.

  7. grendel
    Posted December 28, 2008 at 1:44 pm | Permalink

    “Can a plea of ignorance clear McDonalds from any wrong doing? NO WAY. In fact, criminal law usually considers a plea of ignorance to be a rare case because it usually discredits the whole notion of responsibility of a seller.”

    The aforementioned statement is manifestly untrue. Mala prohibitum v. mala in se aside, the defendant’s state of mind is very often an essential element of a crime, regardless of whether or not it is a vendor/vendee scenario.

    Civil cases, such as the aforementioned Mcdonalds scenario might give rise to, are different. Typically, civil causes of action are determined in light of a legally objective standard, such as the mythical “reasonable person” rule.

    Of course, receiving and selling stolen or forged goods ARE, almost invariably, mala prohibitum crimes. As such, the defendant’s state of mind is rarely an issue.

    Confusing? Perhaps. Regardless, impz characterizations of legal doctrine are of dubious value, and after reading that recent maria+holic review, i am unsure if impz’ anime views are equally bereft of merit. (kidding… if only barely.)

    btw, the quote from the Singaporean forum… huh? Clearly I am not up to speed with the vernacular. Oh well.

    dts

  8. Posted December 28, 2008 at 4:20 pm | Permalink

    @ ClearTranquil
    No need to feel bad. We actually end up amazed by some of the replies we’ve gotten. No doubt I’m at fault for not checking well before buying, their replies are something like “it’s the buyer’s fault, he never checked, he got owed! muwahaha”, “it’s the buyer’s fault, it’s ok to sell bootleg as long as ppl don’t buy them”. I do really have a good laugh after reading at the immaturity of these people really.

  9. Posted December 28, 2008 at 6:01 pm | Permalink

    For a moment I thought this post was about actual recasts, not just cheapskates whining about cheap things.

    But yeah, it always sucks not getting what you thought you were buying, regardless if it was your fault or not.

  10. Posted December 28, 2008 at 7:31 pm | Permalink

    The people over at SGcafe are idiots, most of them. There really isn’t much point in reading the inane chatter of morons. Just ignore what they say, Blurmage, or laugh at the inherent lulz in the posts.

  11. Posted December 28, 2008 at 8:20 pm | Permalink

    If you think the language used in SGcafe is bad, wait till you go to the Mediacock forum. Though SGcafe can probably can give it a run for its money. Immature people are everywhere.

  12. Posted December 28, 2008 at 8:40 pm | Permalink

    The creators of those so called fake figures failed. They shouldnt have copied the same design of the box. They shouldve did it differently. In that way, it would be called fake. I think.

  13. Posted December 28, 2008 at 9:34 pm | Permalink

    @Blurmage: People troll when they want to. They usually do not attempt to comprehend because they choose not to. It’s sad.

    @ClearTranquil: It’s not your fault after all. If it is fake, it is fake. Blurmage was supposed to be more cautious of this, but no one will probably expect a distributor selling fake merchandise like this.

    @Cat: I ain’t a figurine collector. You got to ask Blurmage about it.

    @Kiri: That I agree, but all parties have a fault in this but I believe that the distributor has the responsibility to make sure that they bring in authentic stuff. Saying that they specialize in cosplay removes them from blame is a very flawed argument. I do not wish to discuss further why it is. ^^

    @Pyoro: Ya, it’s sad when they are like “YOU ARE STUPID, YOU SHOULD KNOW BETTER!”. It’s about the fact that bootlegs are available in a convention such as EOY. That cannot be right.

    @Grendel: I lose. That said, my anime views are generally berated by my own blog members. You are so mean though, hitting me where it hurts. I know I have bad taste, and you do not have to rub it in! Thanks for the clarification on the law. I ain’t a lawyer by any means, so I am just stating what I know in terms of the issue. I stand corrected.

    @Stifler & Elva: Sigh. I feel that is the reason why I started out my own blog. As much as forums go, they tend to either border on juvenile language or an extreme distaste for anything that resembles English. In addition, there are enough trolls that will make you grimace in horror simply because they are rather fail trolls. I like my good trolls.

    @Kairu: I think it’s intended to deceive rather than portraying itself as a bootleg. That is the main issue here that I am bothered with.

  14. Posted December 28, 2008 at 9:43 pm | Permalink

    Even in a more prestigious event, Comic Fiesta 08, there were bootleg nendoroids, sold at RM50 ^^;

  15. Posted December 28, 2008 at 9:57 pm | Permalink

    @Yuki: It’s truly Asia. So expect it.

  16. Posted December 28, 2008 at 10:48 pm | Permalink

    definitely the seller fault, most figurine buyer don’t know the difference between original and bootleg. But some seller mention that the figurine is china ver figurine and sell them cheaper (which is okay), and some other seller tries to sell bootleg figurine as expensive as the original (which is bad).

    there’s always seller selling bootlegs in every anime events here in melbourne..

  17. grendel
    Posted December 28, 2008 at 11:18 pm | Permalink

    “It’s truly Asia. So expect it.”

    Humor in anime does not always translate. To “get” humorous anime you often need to BE asian… or at the very least you probably have to have seen so much anime in the past that you are subconsciously aware that something in FLCL is funny. Me, I don’t think that FLCL is funny, and I don’t “get” so much of what is supposed to be humorous in anime. I’m not asian, and I haven’t watched as much anime as many of you.

    Why do I bring up humor in anime? Because humor is hardly the only concept that does not seem to translate smoothly between and betwixt East & West. My area of expertise is First Amendment law (though I concede that it may be a bit presumptuous of me to claim “expertise” in any area of the law.) First Amendment cases carry with them a considerable amount of prestige value, and they pay well if the International Society of Krishna Consciousness is your client. Needless to say, my bosses find other work for me to do when the hare krishnas are not dumping brief cases full of money onto my desk.

    Copyright. I have done a fair amount of copyright work. I guess that it pays the bills. *shrug* Copyright, is not a universal concept. The Asian pov regarding piracy of various sort of media was something that I had a hard time understanding. In the West there are many people who pirate media. Those westerners who pirate media know that what they are doing is wrong. There is a moral stigma that accompanies the “pirate” label.

    In Asia, a person may be aware that media piracy is illegal, but rarely do they concede that piracy is wrong. Likewise, Asian society does not seem to condemn the pirate. If I were to get a speeding ticket tomorrow, my insurance rates would increase and I might have to pay a hefty fine, but my neighbors would not be concerned about my questionable moral fiber. Speeding is illegal, but it isn’t necessarily wrong. In many parts of Asia, getting caught for piracy is almost akin to getting a speeding ticket here in the US. Yes, Asian laws may impose harsh monetary penalties and may even include periods of incarceration for those who violate piracy laws, but the Asian pirate isn’t necessarily viewed as a Bad Person by his neighbors.

    The Asian pov baffles me at times. For example, after viewing mariaholic I felt as if I had lost 20 IQ points… and I really don’t have 20 points to spare. Yuri and Lolli and Siscon are among the ubiquitous seeming anime staples that I just don’t “get.”

    Of course, to be fair, I can’t even get American women to understand why it is sacrilege for me to miss a Notre Dame football game. No doubt I have other behaviors and tastes that might be considered bizarre or obscene by impz.

    dts

  18. Posted December 28, 2008 at 11:39 pm | Permalink

    Wow, pretty silly that people would actually blame the buyer for being tricked. Sure he could have potentially looked at all possible merchandise before buying it by doing hours and hours of research beforehand. But clearly, the seller is in the wrong for doing such things. People don’t expected to be duped at big conventions like this, and if it happens, I really don’t see how it could be the buyer’s fault.

    A better example would be saying that, say he went to McDonalds and bought a beef burger but it was actually pork, and then he unknowingly ate pork against his religion. Blaming him for not knowing that it was pork, would be stupid, when clearly it would be McDonald’s fault (that is of course if they had mens rea, but that’s another topic).

  19. Posted December 29, 2008 at 2:17 am | Permalink

    It disturbs me greatly that the fake’s box looks so ‘authentic’. My sympathies to Blurmage. I think any collector relatively new to the trade would have made this ‘mistake’. While the buyer do have some responsibility, personally, I feel that the onus is on the seller to provide authentic goods. Bootlegs are rather insidious since they can come through the proper channels too (ie the official distributors) so even the retailers sometimes don’t know they have contributed to the bootleg trade. I’d suggest sticking to a trusted source (not just a shop that sells you stuff but also treasures you as a customer and is willing to share PVC expertise) and naturally doubt anything that comes too cheap. Quality comes with a price. To my knowledge, S$30 for a Nendroid is not a typical market price.

    Hope this doesn’t quell the PVC passion!

  20. CatzCradle
    Posted December 29, 2008 at 6:20 pm | Permalink

    Personally, I would be completely fooled. They both look so authentic to me.
    How would one go about telling the difference between fakes and real ones?

  21. Posted December 29, 2008 at 9:20 pm | Permalink

    Back then, I was also fooled, twice, in fact, because I couldn’t spot the differences in figures. I know better now though; it’s partly a fault on both sides – the buyer, because he allowed himself to be tricked, and the seller, because he ended up getting bootlegs in the first place.
    I find that the fakes usually have crappy boxes, printing, material, and so on, and of course, a poorer quality figure which usually “feels” cheap, as opposed to a better, perhaps weightier “original” figure.

  22. deadbeat
    Posted December 31, 2008 at 6:26 am | Permalink

    just to be honest here, sometimes its not the buyer’s fault. some fakes are damn hard to spot especially if you spot something u are mildly interested in but did not do full research beforehand as you did not expect to get it. Also, since you often will not have an internet connection available to u while shopping, its hard to make the correct ‘call’ when it comes to stuff as fine-lined as this.

    Anyway, which is the fake one! the suspense is killing me…

  23. Miku~lover!
    Posted May 9, 2009 at 2:35 am | Permalink

    Hello, and I personally think that the one on the left is real because most of the time you will have Miku’s first face on (the face that looks straight at you). I know this because I have experienced this alot just like other people. Plus, the one on the left has much much more better quality on the outside and inside. So, in that case I am positive that the one on the left is the real original Miku! Oh, and I almost forgot! when I was talking about the box quality if you look carefully it’s so obvious that the right nendroid box is more blurry..Oh yea! I think it was the seller’s fault not yours..well..! 1, people shouldn’t even be selling fake ones…and 2, some people are able to copy really well I mean how the hell are we suppose to see something that isn’t so obvious! Especially whenever you are looking for something and is eager! When we are eager that just means us humans won’t pay attention for ANYTHING!…Anyways that’s all I have to say..BYYA! ^.^

  24. Posted August 13, 2009 at 8:08 pm | Permalink

    Hi , I think that looks pretty cool. Check out another website that has a lot of adorable collectibles figurines for collectors, cake toppers and unique gift ideas at http://www.BostonMiniatures.com/figurines.html. It’s a great website!

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