We often use the word “Deep Anime” to describe an anime of a certain quality, yet the word deep in itself is perhaps a very abstract piece of art. To illustrate this occurrence, the confusion arises when various people consider one of the anime as a deep anime, and you generally go like “What? This is no deep anime!”. Here is an example of this confusion that happened in the IRC channel for #animeblogger.
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[impz] dennou coil is pretty cool
[Sasa] (dennou coil isn’t really “deep”, it has no meaning, but it is quite artsy)
[tj_han] dennou coil is just interesting scifi
[saturnine] (Dennou Coil has no meaning like you are a 16 year old girl Sasa)
[tj_han] like wise i dont think gits is deep
[tj_han] its interesting scifi
[Sasa] (me neither)
[Sasa] (but i’ve considered planetes as quite deep)
[psgels] So, what is a deep series?
However, is anime truly as stated to be a deep symbolism, or simply a form of entertainment? We first have to state how we actually consider this preposition by stating this is the view of the majority of anime. It is not an analysis of a few series that have implied symbolism and psychological theories but a means to observe the general trend of anime as a whole. With that taken care of, it is apparent that anime is a form of entertainment, and not anything deep. I will not deny that I will be generalizing for some of the reasons that I have mentioned, but I believe that most of the generalizations used do have enough merit to hold on its own.
To state anything more is merely the joke of spin doctors.
Owen S, the crazy loony owner of Rule 41, gathered a group of strange anime bloggers to deal with this topic. I guess since I am equally strange as well, I am also roped into the picture. The list of bloggers include Batezi, theBigN, Sasa, Higevs, Hidoshi and Martin.
So why did I call it entertainment?
The main purpose for anime on the whole is mostly entertainment. Like most of entertainment, it is not exactly the form of artwork that delves into deep ideas. It is meant to give pleasure, relaxation or delight and do not require any active participation beyond leisure purposes by the audience. You do not have to think so deeply for any of the series in order to understand the art form that is presented. As it is, it is not meant to complicate things and divide the knowledgeable and the ones that have no clue what is going on.
Anime, as a form, is currently not deep like literature. We generally derive ideas and plots from it as a critic, but the artwork in itself is a very simple display that is open to complications if you want to. Using a personal analogy, I might be analyzing Saiunkoku Monogatari for every episode, but it is mostly a thought of what has happened in terms of plot. It is not an artwork that forces you to think about philosophy. You are invited to think as much as it is.
For my personal theme about it, it is somewhat described in Lupus’s earlier entry on the blog. Hence, I decided that I should not repeat myself that much. To add on, I am not discounting the fact that there are in fact anime series that are thought provoking that has this “deep” value inside. However, these series are more of the exception rather than the rule. Here, my proposition is clearly anime being “deep” on the majority, and not some anime are deep.
The essence of entertainment: Fanservice
Fanservice is generally omnipresent in most of the anime that you and I have watched. It is a visual method in which to excite the fan, generally through sexual means or to amuse the fan who is viewing the visual spectacle. The explosion of genres such as romance and harem (always present) or even action having fanservice should not be breaking news to you as well. Fanservice, by its very notion, is never a deep thing. It is meant to please the fan.
The detail in which to make a true decent show without fanservice is something that has been lost, and it is sadly a part of anime that we anime fans generally appreciate. Without any bit of irony, the use of fanservice these days have been more clumsy (read: obvious) rather than being more subtle in nature. This does not really help in the definition of anime being a deep medium for art. If you do not believe me, count the number of onsen/shower/sports scenes and the definitive beach scene with no fanservice.
Conclusion
There are definitely many inferences that we can try to associate our beloved anime with the word “deep”. However, the brutal truth is that anime is an artwork that seeks merely to entertain. As a “critic” or more accurately an anime blogger who enjoys his share of interesting and plot-heavy anime series, I have to say that there are definitely a few shows that can represent the “deep” nature that we are looking for, but they are few and little in the forest. Until the point of time that we can say that most of the anime we watch have a nature that seeks less to entertain, but to indivulge ourselves into an intellectual and informative world, anime remains merely entertainment and nothing else.
20 Comments
>>Fanservice, by its very notion, is never a deep thing.
Objection!
The Melancholy of Suzumiya Haruhi is a very deep show!
I believe that anime is merely entertainment, BUT it can be as deep as the author intends it to be. Or it can be as deep as we want to perceive it.
*Possible Spoilers now…*
Take for example, Sola. It felt like a standard harem to me at first. However, as it progressed, it was way more than that, relative to my first impressions. It developed “deeper” themes like life and death and loneliness. Actually, you can call that deep or call it shallow, but it is a theme of some type nonetheless and the authors developed it nicely as the anime progressed, changing the way I perceived it as I watched, from an assumed harem to a tragedy of some sort.
To me, Sola was somewhat deep, while maintaining entertainment value. To this day, not that it was very long ago, Sola is still one of my favorite animes of all time.
End Spoilers*
I feel most anime is intended to entertain us, while giving us something to think about. It is apparent that we perceive this notion of “deepness” because it came about from the anime we watch. Some writers intend for some anime to keep us thinking while some anime are created merely for entertainment and fun. And yes, some anime do keep us thinking, hence we call them deep. But keep in mind it is as deep as the person perceives it and also how well the writer executes his or her presentation and intentions.
While I would say that it’s unfortunate how fanservice is becoming an increasingly popular trend nowadays, I’m guilty of enjoying part of it. It just gives you the excitement and pleasure watching them. On the other hand, too much of a good thing can be a bad thing, and I believe that this applies very well to fanservice. Such anime series just end up being lame and boring IMO.
Entertainment can be pretty deep too. Just because you enjoy it, doesn’t mean it isn’t deep.
I would compare anime to fictional books rather than anime to literature. Out of fictional books, the vast majority are less than thought provoking. There are a lot more shallow books than deep books out there. However, you wouldn’t call all books shallow, right? Just as you can’t say all books are deep.
IMO, it’s same as anime. There are deep animes, there are shallow animes. There are many, many, many animes in between. Personally, I think the topic itself is somewhat of a fallacy. But that’s just me.
I’m not going to think too hard because it’s 3:30.
Can anime be deep? Definitely. I’m not denying that possibility. But like you said, the deep ones are the exception rather than the rule. And oh those exceptions are so few and far between.
As deep as you want it to be.
Too bad we humans don’t use that grey matter too often.
I’d pretty much agree, but I’m not sure not being deep is necessarily a bad thing. I mean, making you think always seems to help make a movie or TV show that is good into a great movie or show, sure. Ultimately, I watch anime because it’s entertaining and not because I wish to become a philosophy master.
Of course, I think most people realize and agree with all of this, except for those who think that if it’s animated and from Japan, then it must be deeper than The Matrix or something, which is pretty silly on it’s face. All I’d have to do is find a DVD of Girls’ Bravo to prove that belief wrong.
As for fan service, I’d generally agree, though I still think there are plenty of shows around that don’t have fan service, or at least not enough to make it bothersome. I mean, almost anything – and I’m talking live-action TV and movies, have their own version of “fan service” usually. It’s how it’s used and how much it’s used that’s important rather than whether it exists or not (though I’m pretty sure that was basically your point anyway).
Anime shall be entertaining.
Who cares if it’s “deep
I agree. Anime has mostly been a form of entertainment. (You actually helped cleared up my thoughts with anime, thanks. ^_^) Now I know the anime I will forever look for: An anime that not only “seeks less to entertain, but to indivulge ourselves into an intellectual and informative world”, but has the nice cute art designs you can find today. Kanon 2006, for example, didn’t have that feeling; aspects of it just don’t give the vibe I’m looking for, though it’s a extremely well done show. Rurouni Kenshin, on the other hand…is closer. Kenshin’s past certainly can’t be far from it, considering it’s number #1 spot in Anime News Network…
But yeah. I look for some Moe AND entertaining AND deep… in a true way. Discrimination is probably the deepest one we are able to relate daily life to. Now have the victim be very moe, and it could get very heartbreaking… I’d love to see that… oh whatever, lol.
answer? both.
Entertainment can be deep. There is no line drawn between these two words. Entertainment can be shallow as well as deep. Entertainment is to let us feel something in times of boredom – my definition, that is.
I can give a few examples of deep and shallow anime title but at the end of the day, there are ALL [b]ENTERTAINMENT[/b]! There’s no line drawn between the two. And deep is just one word to describe entertainment, not an entirety of notion.
Haha, fanservice that can help to contribute to storyplot, I see no harm in them. But if fanservice is just for the sake of whetting the appetite of interested people, that will irk me seriously. I am not against fanservice but it should be kept to minimum and for a meaning to it!
An anime being deep lets us reflect on things we rarely think of in our spare or casual time… just like literature or television shows, films and books. They are all stories to! ENTERTAIN.
I finally realized the pains of real life. I am really getting owned by real life these days.
@Lolikit: deep penetration show? OKKKKKK?
@Kyokii: Hmm, I do somewhat agree with you but the perception of how deep an anime is does not deter from the fact that the artwork in itself is not a complicated thing that you might not understand or appreciate if you do not understand the patterns in it. Anime is simplistic and seeks to entertain, which is why I believe that the depth of the personal viewer is not that important.
@Nekonron: I am enjoying fanservice myself. I do not think that fanservice is a bad thing at all. It is good but I am not arguing whether it is good or bad, merely that it does not define “deepness”.
@Briar: Entertainment can be deep or shallow, but still primarily entertainment. That is why you call it entertainment, where the primary reason to viewing it is to excite or enjoy the artwork presented to you.
I do not believe that the topic in itself is a fallacy in which the artwork never bothers to fully enforce any intectuall or informative data onto you. It is a passive action of the viewer, and does not require active participation beyond the amount of leisure to understand.
@Lupus: rule.
@Drm: ?_? grey matter?
@Josh: Oh, i definitely do not think that not having any depth is a bad thing. I mean, is Ichigo Mashimaro or Midori no Hibi deep shows? nope. Yet, they have huge entertainment values. It is perhaps a bit confusing that I have portrayed deepness as a good quality and entertainment as a bad quality.
However, to be honest, there is no good or bad regarding the two terms. They are just terms for discussion.
@無
Hey there. Love the blog, its been a really interesting visit!
Anyway back to the topic. I’d agree that Anime is more of an Art and entertainment form rather than a “deep thought” genre. Of course I’ve watched several noted exceptions and those are probably some of the best anime shows I’ve watched since I love “deep and meaningful” stuff.
These days fanservice are definitely quite blatant. I usually even have an anime, from its large popularity, producers would just make an OVA or some special that’s almost entirely plot-less and fanservice orientated :p
Grey matter. Brains.
Lupus, people don’t use their brains very often. That’s the problem
Someone who said anime is deep is my own mother, and she’s 54. Yes, my mother is an anime fan and everytime whatches something with me and it rings to her she goes: “you see, like real life, you should learn something from this”.
I love my mum!
Once upon a time, when I saw Lain (my first anime other than english dubbed pokemon), and tracking down similar titles such as Boogiepop Phantom and GITS: SAC, I used to think ‘wow don’t Japanese have something invigorating in their cartoons than what you see in average cartoon channels’. Although I still enjoy shows like Code Geass and Lucky Star on purely entertainment level, it’s quite sad that I no longer have vast supply of ‘deep’ shows (at that point of time, the supply seemed limitless), because the overall impact they have on you is on a whole different scale. This opinion of mine is of course, still considering them on the entertainment level, since entertainment value is so much higher when we are engaged to think and feel about those pretty things happening on the screen. But same can be said about films. There’s not many films featuring in my local cinema that I’d consider as ‘deep’.
I personally don’t see the merit behind the need to discuss such a ridiculous question, since the statement ‘vast majority of anime seeks to entertain, and only a few are profound’ is commonly accepted by those who are reasonable.
@Janice: I actually feel that anime sometimes has the potential to be deeper, but that will also turn off most anime watchers who sit to be entertained. It’s just not a good mass market tool. Fanservice is clearly very deadly in ovas, and I cannot but agree with you completely on that.
It’s to please the fans though. They do drive the economy for the anime companies.
@Drm: @_@ who likes to use their brain all the time anyway.
@Lia: Hahah, i DEFINITELY will love your mom. Is she of a need for a foster son by any chance?
@Gaguri: Well, I personally am a new person in terms of anime viewing. I just started intensively when i started this blogging site. It is perhaps a very hard topic to really conclude, and I actually wrote this during a period that I have a serious case of writer’s block.
Nevertheless, I am no huge fan of something that is overly deep because I prefer to enjoy my entertainment. I guess that is why i am no literature student myself. Nevertheless, when a show is both entertaining and has a good story depth, it is the type of show that will interest anyone.
With so many words yet so little meaning.Hmm I wonder if the view shall ever be expressions of the difference at hand, or of mind. OR just an idea at the moment.For witch anime shall I define into My sight. Or could it be that i’m wondering just like so many else.I’ll keep watching just to see whats next in the realization of an idea.I suppose…
Seems like you’ve been watching all the wrong animes if you were looking for deep.
I would like recommend, “now & then here & there”
But if your into “themes” deep, then I would suggest Full Metal Alchemist
@ Blazing
Now where the hell did that come from?
I’m not sure about deep anime
But thought provoking-wise, Bartender would be one I consider (very few anime has made me think so much at night)
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