Airdate of this episode, August 10, 2008…Nagasaki a-bomb dropped, August 9, 1945
While the last couple of episodes were mostly setup, this week was uh, definitely the punch line. It was also the punch out line for several characters, who are presumed dead (note nobody is ever dead in a Sunrise show until you see the body). This week we get combat, mayhem, prison breaks, and a nasty WMD for super duper cheesy and obvious ironic effect.
Table-tan thinks she can actually pilot Lancelot and drop FREIA (Field Limitary Effective Implosion Armament, what a horrible acronym) on Zero, how silly. Throughout most of the battle she is seriously off her rocker raging at Suzaku telling him to use it and nuke Zero along with the evil Elevens. It’s never really explained why she is a racist, but it’s not like I particularly care. I hope she dies.
I’m glad they saved the Siegfried, so Orange-kun could say a line dripping in awesome like “my storm of loyalty!” You are awesome Orange-kun, the only character in anime history brought back from the dead by 2ch. I can’t wait until you get your new space mecha that’s shown in the OP.
Looking so pimp there Orange-kun
Run Millay!
As I said last week, bad idea to send batty fake brother to save Nunally! Crazy for nii-san! Bonkers! He’ll probably die before this is all over too. As an aside, Sayoko looks awesome in her Mai Otome supameido ninja gear.
Wow! Fucking useless Ougi. He may bring people together by being a total wet noodle but he is useless in a real fight. He should know the battle plans and he’s experienced in fighting, he’s just nearly as useless as Tamaki.
My princess is free, free like a bird!
Aaaaand another geass mindfuck that we have no explanation for -_- I want to know already dammit! Anya needs some serious geass canceling!
I like the credits with the cute animals, definitely Cecile’s doing. Also, what the hell is up with that acronym? Superlative Extruder? Are they just making this shit up?
Oh yes, super hax Guren launch
The Emperor arrives, but Schniezel makes a sugguestion that the Emperor doesn’t really care about this battle, doesn’t care about today or reality. That means he cares about the supernatural stuff, like the World of C, so perhaps he’s going to Kaminejima in his new super flying fortress thingy.
Useless, but in a somewhat amusing way. Didn’t last long either…
Haha, it was hugely telegraphed that she was about to appear to save him, but it was still cool to see anyways. Welcome back my princess, Lelouch and me both dearly missed you.
Oh that felt good too, we all know Kallen is a “badass mother!” (dubs are hilarious) but the new Gurren is pretty damn hax. Sorry Crusader, but your favorite crazy guy became the first Rounds to kick the bucket in this series. Note that we haven’t even seen more than like 5 seconds of 3 of the Rounds, not sure how they are going to fit them into the story, if at all.
Ugh, this doesn’t exactly bode well, although I don’t really know what some grunt whose name I didn’t even remember would have. Asahina has bee stupidly trying to rebel against Zero for a long time, and for what purpose? Does he think anyone else can lead the Japanese to independence? Toudou failed, Ougi failed, who else can do it? Asahina himself? Hah, fat chance. Fellow’s probably dead now though…
The Princess has left the building
I guess it’s Kallen’s turn to have the super duper hax KMF that’s better than everyone else for a couple of episode. It was pretty nice to see the Lancelot finally get it’s ass kicked, it’s been such a spoiler through like 30-40 episodes. However, as we all know KMF top dog status only lasts for a short time and I’m sure the new version of Lancelot will be as strong or stronger than the current Gurren.
Saw this coming from a million miles away too, even if I hadn’t read some of the rampant spoilers out there. They wouldn’t have kept referring to that geass if it wasn’t going to play some important part later on in the story this season. They wanted to load as much cheesy irony onto its use as possible. The guy who said he was going to protect the Japanese just nuked 10 million+ Japanese. The guy who said he was going to protect Nunally just presumably nuked her too. A bit too predictable for my tastes, I prefer the crazy tweeeeeeests.
“Bring Out Yer Dead” Nagasaki Death Counter
1) Nunally
2) Sayoko
3) Millay
4) Guilford
5) Asahina
6) Miss Rohmeier
It would really be irritating if this was the way Nunally died. People were predicting death by Suzaku’s geass for Nunally since the episode Lelouch put it on him, it’s way too obvious and forced irony. However, as I said before nobody in a Sunrise show is dead until you see the body, and even then there are exceptions. Nunally could have very well been ported off to the World of C or some supernatural crap, or a huge list of other plot twists that could save her and the others. Out of that list, those that looked the most dead and have the least reason to come back are Guilford and Asahina. Miss Rohmeier? Nobody really cares about her so dead is good. Sayoko and Millay have a bit more plot armor then those two, and of course Nunally is a hugely central character to the show. To me it seems kind of like a weak attempt to get an enraged/emo/shit-faced killer Lelouch to come out and cause problems.
Crazy mutterings of wanting to talk to dead people are never good. Plenty of material for emo facial expressions on Lelouch, I’m sure Crusader will post them gleefully.
Overall, a pretty powerful episode and one that will serve as a definite turning point in the series. The cast is inordinately large and was in desperate need of a culling, and this episode provided the perfect opportunity to do so. Aside from the aforementioned nuke deaths, combat claimed Luciano and some Black Knights grunt that was Asahina’s buddy. Tamaki lives though, he appears in the previews for the next episode unfortunately.
Next Episode:
Low quality extended preview of episode 19.
No talky from Lelouch in this preview means serious business. Next week, Ashford survives as Lelouch rages on Rolo for failing to save Nunally. Schniezel shows up on the Ikagura with Cornelia and Ougi looks raged (Looks like Lelouch’s cover is blown! Shit will hit the fan!). Orange-kun shields Lelocuh and Suzaku alternates between looking emo and creepily laughing out loud looking over the hole that used to be the Tokyo settlement.
Crusader’s Angry Drunken Rant
The Nagasaki explosion before and after.
Britannia 1 America 0. ALL HAIL BRITANNIA!
Hello Infinite Justice Guren!
So yes much weeping and complaints about a fictional WMD in lieu of the real tragedy that was Nagasaki. Ah well I bet most of you forget the significance of having that Freja, or whatever they’re calling it these days, bomb go off the day Bockscar buzzed over Nagasaki with a single bomb. Man that was so deliciously snarky of Sunrise, to prove that their bomb is better because it creates a crater! In any case just thought you folk would like to know that maybe the Sunrise team has something to say about WMDs, like that they need Japanese delivery systems for instance.
I liked the Cecile touch…
Hey Louise how’s Saji? Need a hand?
Clearly Lulu has not interest in women…
So it seems that Guren has become Infinite Justice and soon Lancelot will become Strike Freedom at this rate…So sad to see that all these float packs have turned this series into a Gundam series of sorts. Even the Slash harkens have been relegated to tow cables with the introduction of beam weapons out the ass. Well in any case they have started to kill off some characters, Asahina, Ten-san and his comely team (such a waste), Shirin Romeyer, Nunnally, Millay, Sayako, and Guilford. Still given that Sunrise has proved most insipid about resurrecting characters I believe that Sayako and Nunnally will make it out some how given the lack of dramatic death scene. Guilford might pull off a Patrick but since Cornelia sensed a disturbance in the force I doubt it.
Tamaki is a buddy fucker in more ways than one…
Oh shi- he just said waifu…I distinctly heard waifu.
Sorry Zero but Tamaki already got the paper work done, and Nunnally did not speak now so will forever hold her peace… I now pronounce you Lulu and Tamaki. Were you hoping for Rolo or perhaps Orange-kun your emo-ness?
All in all a good day and it seems that Asahina discovered something, and Kallen’s rescue was priority no. 3. Glad to see the dumb bitch doesn’t mind to be no. 3 on the Zero priority list no doubt priority no. 2 was to find some pizza for C2. The bomb goes off because of Lulu’s Geass, and right when Suzaku was willing to die, how deliciously ironic. Man this operation was botched not only is Ougi useless but they had to call upon Tamaki to save Zero…Oh yeas much cries of being Zero’s buddy were heard. Sad to see that Tamaki was not caught in the blast, but I guess the Sunrise team just loves the fella. Suffice to say Rolo wins, just as planned…
So that’s why my Cornelia-hime has been keeping her arm like that…
Guilford was right in two ways one Cornelia must live. Second Lulu is a princess, albeit a very ugly and emo one, but a princess nonetheless given how Lulu always needs saving…
My princess is lovely as ever for no prison can hold her!
It was good to see Lulu rage about Nunnally’s “death” and it seems that Lloyd and Ceclie were not keen on installing some sort of lock out on their super Guren, but I suppose they were too busy making a jab at that opium smoking bint. Cornelia-hime escapes with her new gadgets and hopefully will make her way back to friendly lines now that Schniezel has the perfect opportunity to announce that Lulu was behind it all and lie about how Lulu had Geassed Suzaku into detonating the bomb. I expect Lulu to get ronrey real soon with only Orange-kun, Rolo, C2, possibly Kallen, and most important of all Tamaki at his side once the announcement is made. I expect much Lulu crying and raging as he can’t actually strike Rolo out of fear, so I guess C2 will serve as punching bag for Lulu’s mistake. I still can’t believe Lulu sent Rolo to rescue Nunnally and expected him to succeed.
What another gift for Rolo?
Oh man C2 is going to get it…
Cry some more!
Because one of you asked: What do I think of Nina, best mad Scientist EVAR she can hump my tables any day.
This was a triumph!
I’m making a note here:
“BOOM SUCCESS!!”
It’s hard to overstate
my satisfaction.
Nina Science:
We do what we must
because we can.
For the good of all of us.
Except the ones who are dead.
But there’s no sense crying
over Lulu’s mistakes.
You just keep on trying
till you run out of cake.
And my science gets done.
And you make a neat bomb
for the people who are
still alive.
I’m not even angry…
I’m being so sincere right now-
Even though Lulu broke my heart,
and failed to kill me.
I tore Nunally to pieces.
I threw every piece into a fire.
As Nunnally burned it hurt because
I was so happy for Lulu!
Now, these points of data
make a beautiful line.
And we’re out of beta.
We’re releasing on time!
So I’m GLaD I wasn’t burned-
Think of all the things we learned-
for the people who are
still alive.
Go ahead and leave me…
I think I’d prefer to stay inside…
Maybe you’ll find someone else
to help you?
Maybe Black Knight Asahina?
That was a joke! HAHA!! FAT CHANCE!!
Anyway this revenge is great!
It’s so delicious and moist!
Look at me: still talking
when there’s science to do!
When I look out there,
it makes me GLaD I’m not you.
I’ve experiments to run.
There is research to be done.
On the people who are
still alive.
And believe me I am
still alive.
I’m doing science and I’m
still alive.
I feel fantastic and I’m
still alive.
While you’re dying I’ll be
still alive.
And when you’re dead I will be
still alive.
Still alive.
Still alive.
69 Comments
@Halcyon
Wow long post first of all Unfortanetely Lancelot doesn’t have an ejection seat so even if he tried to eject yeah…..
Secondly ever since Season 1 He’s been trying to atone for his “sins” by putting himself in danger or in the edge of death. Basically he’s an emo who’s too afraid too kill himself and just looks for an alternate way to do it which is the reason for his “moral”.
And the reason he shoots freia to “live on” is because the shiny light from the bomb would’ve distracted them long enough for him to escape, and it did let’s all look at the light and ignore the fleeing KNF) if he had tried to escape normally Guren’s speed would’ve been too much. It was his only option XP (P.S. I tried to put logic into the joke)
I know he’s been deathflagged I just wish SPOILER::::::: That he would save lelouch (wikipedia nuff said) and die already he’s annoying NIIIIIIIII SAMA I’m going to kill nunally so I don’t have to share you NIIIIIII SAMA and so he annoy’s me
@cj
what I’m saying is, Suzaku should’ve withdrawn when he was told to by Cecile and Lloyd and, if anything, LOL he didn’t have to point his MASSIVE BOMB at his own Government Center. If you’re going to point it at ANYBODY, point it at Lelouch at least THAT WAY, the only people who would’ve died/gotten hurt would’ve been the Black Knight enemy forces and not the civvies who were just trying to escape from the battlefield.
Suzaku is just a suicidal moron of epic proportions.
@Halcyon
Yeah I get it it’s just funny if he shot the bomb for the reason I pointed out I mean you have to admit it does make for a good distraction everyone stopped doing what they where doing just to look at the shininess I understood what you were saying.
And I agreee with you he is a suicidal moron.
@Halcyon
Really? You’ve seen 1 Million people aboard the Ikaruga have you? Because I assure you, his “army” is not 1 Million Strong. His “Army” at best may be a couple of thousand. Lelouch does not have the resources or the command structure to mobilize one million troops on his own. Hence why he set up strategic allegiances with the Chinese Federation and the EU via the UFN.
To re-iterate, “He freaking filled out his army with them and uses the rest of them as a totally secure base of operations and manpower pool!”. Friend of lies that you are that you seek to make this mean he took one million people out of Zero uniforms and put them in black knight uniforms, he did exactly what I said he did, filled out his org structure and with the untold chaff that did not possess skills he desired founded a city he uses as his own private country where he is the God-King Zero.
This is patently false. It’s been discussed in Season One, that the entire reason for Suzaku’s “selflessness” is subconscious guilt from murdering his father. Suzaku’s “morality” is nothing more than an idealistic way for him to escape the reality of being a cold-blooded murderer.
With this latest development, Suzaku will be unable to run from away from his sins by attempting to die vaingloriously on the battlefield. As shown on the extended preview, Suzaku will be just as emotionally broken/devastated as Lelouch which is a delicious parallel.
Indeed Suzaku’s re-invention of himself from thoughtless bully steeped in unearned pride into a selfless soldier was caused by his subconscious guilt at murdering his father. Suzaku’s morality is derived from the perspective his mistakes have earned him. They are the result of it, they are not the manifestation of it. With Euphies help he came to terms with himself, and happily remained who he was.
Millions have died at his hand. He should perchance be joyful? Or seeing that some hours would have gone by since then argue that it is the past and thus irrelevant?
Euphie had delayed Geass because deep down her true nature contradicted her Geass Order. Euphie was a pacifist and she was struggling against her Geass to the very end. Suzaku’s Geass was to “Live on”, self-preservation is a basic instinct of all animals, and he had no real true inner nature to contradict his Geass command. Hence, he took the course that he felt would fulfill his Geass command: Kill everyone else in order to live on.
Delicious Irony? Yes, especially coming from the White Knight: Suzaku. Who, by now, has earned his Season One nickname of the “White Reaper”.
Indeed he failed, Vernor Vinges “A Fire Upon the Deep” reference, a suicide pact is not the firmest ground for an alliance with ones subconscious. ‘Tis tragic that his best endeavors were not sufficient, but indeed they were his best endeavors honestly made.
And they call Lulu a liberator and the UFN a hope for the future. PR is everything and people are at times fuckwits, ‘ere they with horror see the truth.
Suzaku was not mentally prepared to handle the responsibility of handling the FLEIA. Truly, last episode he was more than ready to make-up with Lelouch until Kanon came in with the Gestapo to arrest him. It was irresponsible to send someone who is already psychologically damaged and emotionally frayed into battle against his former best friend armed with a WMD. Furthermore, even without a “cancel code”, Suzaku could’ve smashed the controls to prevent him from launching FLEIA.
Your ability to rationalize away Suzaku’s blatant perpetration of mass murder is awe-inspiring.
In recognizing that the one who bore freya into battle must with the courage to use it possess the courage to not use it Suzaku said the words that indicated him the most worthy prospective candidate to shoulder its responsibility. When he accepted death rather than employ it to save his own life he lived those words and proved himself most worthy. Such convictions can not be tritely swept aside no matter how deeply you wish they could be, his soul is Great and Good.
Last Episode, Lulu Went Bad. Lulu at the start if episode 17 wasn’t Lulu at the end of it. This Lulu needs to be put down.
And caused a mislaunch. Or succeeded, and had to hot-wire it in a flurry of geass activity. Monday morning quarterbacking again.
By his hand are millions dead. Directly against his manifested will. By Lulu’s will are millions dead. That’s magical mindcontrol in the hands of a self-righteous teenager for you. If only CC hadn’t come along and let Lulu go on a shooting spree at Ashford in six months like he was probably going to.
Suzaku was not alone on the battlefield. If he wanted to withdraw(as he had been advised to earlier by Lloyd and Cecile), he could’ve requested backup from the Gareth forces, the Mordred, or the Tristan which could’ve disengaged from his battle with the Seigfreid to assist in recovering Suzaku’s cockpit (if ejecting the cockpit was his chosen alternative).
I believe, what led Suzaku to choosing to detonate a bomb (in the direction of his own base lolnice aiming Suzaku) was Nina’s last minute advice that using the “FLEIA” would “save him”.
But again, Lelouch’s only command was for Suzaku to live, not to murder millions of people. You can’t extrapolate a “live” command, into “kill tons of people” and lay the blame at Lelouch’s feet for HOW Suzaku chose to live, because ultimately it was a choice by Suzaku.
Furthermore, I’m not sure why you find it so unbelievable that a man who murdered his own father in cold-blood would be able to murder others he is completely unrelated to.
This is dishonest farce and lies. He couldn’t run without being cut down. He couldn’t eject without being picked off. He couldn’t surrender without being cut down. Nobody could stand up to Guren. One path remained, and when a path was required it was employed.
That one enamoured of Lulu can not see how evil and disgust the irresistible compulsion to personal survival is is not surprising. In all circumstances, Suzaku must in direct contradiction of his beliefs place his own life paramount to all other concerns. Children screaming for help in a building engulfed in flames? Screw ‘em. Maniac gunning down the defenseless and him an unarmed bystander? Tough luck. Racial purists frame him for regicide in order to wipe away all internal progress his ethnicity have made in a hostile system and the only way to counter it is to man up and go “Dreyfus”? Screw that, he’s running.
Don’t have to take this on faith, Sunrise deigns to show. Fuck that, they then take the time to explain. Suzaku Kururugi is convert to morality, he’s walking the walk. He’s freakn’ Saul of Tarsus and watching what happened after he killed his dad was his Road to Damascus.
Here is a fact you cannot escape:
Suzaku has now murdered (that’s right, murdered as in willfully and intentionally using a weapon of mass destruction) more innocent civilians and Britannian forces than Lelouch has in two Seasons.
This is irrefutable. You can try to spin events all you want but ultimate responsibility lies in the man who AIMED and pulled the trigger. No matter what kind of “Nuremburg Defense” you might use it does not absolve personal responsibility on the battlefield.
Euphie was able to resist her Geass Command (to an extent) because she found it apalling. Suzaku should have had the same fortitude, but apparently, killing millions of people wasn’t all that abhorrent to Suzaku that he, you know, might’ve struggled, just a little bit, when pulling that trigger.
He tried. He failed. There is no intent when ones actions were dictated by maliscious employment magical powers by a hostile party. This is the ‘witchcraft’ defense, somewhat older but not without successful precedent.
I will say one thing, jack: “Intent” doesn’t matter much to the victims or their families. Suzaku fired the bomb, even if Lulu was the one who gave him the “live” Geass. He could’ve run, but apparently didn’t think he could and went for the bomb. Lulu has his part to blame in this (the initial Live Geass, and not ordering Orange-kun to un-Geass Suzaku) as does Kallen (if she’d killed him faster, this wouldn’t be an issue… and she had the power to do so in the new Guren Seiten). But Suzaku will have to bear his own cross as well, given that there were many opportunities to end this – he could’ve killed Zero way back when, several times, so this situation wouldn’t have come around. He could’ve refused to carry the nuke, or taken Guren Seitan into battle since the OS had been broken open enough to let Cecile add pretty pictures to the OS. He also could’ve ordered someone to kill him indirectly, if he was truly intent on suicide.
In the end, ten million people suffered for the ‘oops’ with the bomb. And, as far as the Elevens are concerned, Suzaku fired the bomb willingly on his own people – whether he ‘wanted’ to or not doesn’t matter; the only difference here is whether he goes emo over killing everyone in Tokyo or goes emo because he’s busy blaming Lulu for what he did.
Attempting neither to defend or condemn Bombzaku, allow me to point out that the ‘command’ geass appears to function by rearranging a person’s neural pathways, not by rewriting them entirely. Note the brain-through-the-iris animation sequences. Lulu’s geass cannot force a person to perform an action that is beyond their capability or conceptualization. To my knowledge, no such attempt has ever been made in the series, save for Lulu’s command to a dying Shirley, which, ruling out the potentially nullifying effects of the geass canceler, likely failed because it was an impossible instruction to fulfill. This implies that Suzuka was not stretching his imagination when he opted to deploy FLEIA as a last resort. To him, it was a possibility, and a viable one at that. I do not subscribe to the Power of Suggestion (courtesy of Ms. Batshit) argument, because Suzuka had a good long while to contemplate the detonation of the warhead and its consequences for the Tokyo Settlement’s denizens. The point here is that he considered it as a possible solution to his dilemma, weighing the lives of millions against the opportunity capture/punish/kill Zero in one fell swoop. That, more than anything else, vividly portrays Suzaku’s unstable mentality.
What I am really curious about here is how geass’ origins and the Black Knights’ battle for supremacy will plot-converge in the end. Lulu seems so obsessed with retrieving Nunnally that I cannot imagine how his efforts will ultimately position him to deal with Charles. Furthermore, I would like to know the true origins of geass and the reason why geass propagation cults were formed in the first place. There are still many, many questions left to be answered.
@Jack
To re-iterate, “He freaking filled out his army with them and uses the rest of them as a totally secure base of operations and manpower pool!”. Friend of lies that you are that you seek to make this mean he took one million people out of Zero uniforms and put them in black knight uniforms, he did exactly what I said he did, filled out his org structure and with the untold chaff that did not possess skills he desired founded a city he uses as his own private country where he is the God-King Zero.
There is no evidence to support your wild unsubstantiated theory. The 1 Million Japanese people are, for all intents and purposes, living free and independent lives on a nice artificial island off the coast of China until proven otherwise.
Indeed Suzaku’s re-invention of himself from thoughtless bully steeped in unearned pride into a selfless soldier was caused by his subconscious guilt at murdering his father. Suzaku’s morality is derived from the perspective his mistakes have earned him. They are the result of it, they are not the manifestation of it. With Euphies help he came to terms with himself, and happily remained who he was.
Uhhhhhhhh, Suzaku isn’t being “selfless”, he’s being “selfish”, his actions aren’t motivated by altruism towards others. His actions are motivated by his own desire to exercise himself of his own guilt. The heroism is a byproduct, not an end goal for Suzakul. Ultimately, it’s just another coping mechanism for killing his own father.
In effect, Suzaku is attempting to absolve himself through suicide. That is not courage, that is the very definition of cowardice. If he really wanted to become a “hero”, he would first do so by taking responsibility for murdering his father which he has yet to do. In fact, he did the very opposite by running towards his father’s enemy, Britannia, to lose himself.
In recognizing that the one who bore freya into battle must with the courage to use it possess the courage to not use it Suzaku said the words that indicated him the most worthy prospective candidate to shoulder its responsibility. When he accepted death rather than employ it to save his own life he lived those words and proved himself most worthy. Such convictions can not be tritely swept aside no matter how deeply you wish they could be, his soul is Great and Good.
This is where you are tragically mistaken. Suzaku has not only accepted death but embraced it wholeheartedly. He has been seeking it out ever since Season One.
Last Episode, Lulu Went Bad. Lulu at the start if episode 17 wasn’t Lulu at the end of it. This Lulu needs to be put down.
Went bad? What show have YOU been watching? Lelouch has “been bad” ever since he got his Geass. He’s only now becoming worse because of the constant betrayals by those he seems to trust/reach out to.
If anything, this Lelouch needs to cut loose and be true to his “Demon King” persona. Enough with the kid gloves, he needs to play hardball. That is the only way his revolution will succeed.
And caused a mislaunch. Or succeeded, and had to hot-wire it in a flurry of geass activity. Monday morning quarterbacking again.
Any attempt to actually render the WMD inoperable is certainly more preferable to keeping it active, then firing it on non-combatants.
By his hand are millions dead. Directly against his manifested will. By Lulu’s will are millions dead. That’s magical mindcontrol in the hands of a self-righteous teenager for you. If only CC hadn’t come along and let Lulu go on a shooting spree at Ashford in six months like he was probably going to.
By his hand? How again, do you rationalize a “LIVE” Geass, translating into killing tens of millions of people? Please explain that one to me.
Because again, if Suizaku has been seeking death since Season One and was even willing to allow Kallen to fry him, then even attempting to escape and failing to escape would’ve fulfilled his most earnest desire to die on the battlefield instead of killing his own troops.
Again, your Nuremburg Defense of “someone told me to do it” fails the test as Lelouch’s Geass Command is the very opposite of what Suzaku did. Live =/= Kill.
This is dishonest farce and lies. He couldn’t run without being cut down. He couldn’t eject without being picked off. He couldn’t surrender without being cut down. Nobody could stand up to Guren. One path remained, and when a path was required it was employed.
This is simply not true.
Firstly, Suzaku had back up in the form of TWO Knight of Rounds in the Area which could’ve been called in for assistance.
Secondly, Suzaku had already wanted to die, thinking his death would atone for his earlier murder of his father and possible betrayal (twice) of his so-called friend.
By Suzaku’s OWN ACTIONS, getting cut down would’ve been preferable to his subsequent action of murdering masses of Japanese and Britannians. Your logic simply fails to acknowledge this simple simple fact.
That one enamoured of Lulu can not see how evil and disgust the irresistible compulsion to personal survival is is not surprising.
I’ve made many post acknowledging Lelouch’s amoral behavior. It’s not being “enamoured” of him. It’s simply accepting his character as intended, as written by Sunrise for the show.
Lelouch is a far more interesting and controversial character as he is now than he would be if Sunrise made him into a pathetic weak ineffectual Suzaku clone.
For all of Suzaku’s claims of changing Britannia from within, he has become part of the problem, not the solution. This episode only further illustrates that Suzaku acts in lockstep with whatever orders he’s given by his Britannian Masters, no matter how morally ambiguous those orders may be.
In all circumstances, Suzaku must in direct contradiction of his beliefs place his own life paramount to all other concerns.
Self-preservation is a basic response of every animal. That cannot be disputed. If you wish to attempt to, please speak with your nearest anthropologist
Children screaming for help in a building engulfed in flames? Screw ‘em. Maniac gunning down the defenseless and him an unarmed bystander? Tough luck. Racial purists frame him for regicide in order to wipe away all internal progress his ethnicity have made in a hostile system and the only way to counter it is to man up and go “Dreyfus”? Screw that, he’s running.
Millions of people running to escape from a battlezone? Nuke ‘em! Because that’s much better than running away!
Suzaku Kururugi is convert to morality, he’s walking the walk. He’s freakn’ Saul of Tarsus and watching what happened after he killed his dad was his Road to Damascus.
If he was walking the walk, he never would’ve agreed to sortie with FLEIA attached to Lancelot. You don’t walk into a firefight with a loaded gun without any intentions of using it. He gambled that Lelouch would be intimidated by his bomhax and failed and now has to bear the additional burden of his carelessness.
He tried. He failed.
There was no indication that he struggled with his Geass Command in the same way Euphie did. In fact, he embraced it wholeheartedly and fired without a second’s pause. He did not “try”, he simply took the course of action that Nina had been suggesting without thinking of the consequences.
What’s even more absurd was that he fired in the direction of his OWN base. That’s just inexcusable.
There is no intent when ones actions were dictated by maliscious employment magical powers by a hostile party. This is the ‘witchcraft’ defense, somewhat older but not without successful precedent.
Funny, “Live” means “Kill” in your logic, right? Your argument, unfortunately, simply holds no water when presented against the facts of Lelouch’s actual Geass command.
@Haesslich
We may have our differences but I agree with a few of the things you posted.
Suzaku fired the bomb, even if Lulu was the one who gave him the “live” Geass.
Right on the money. Ultimate responsibility lies with he who pulls the trigger. Not he who gives the command to pull the trigger. Well played.
He could’ve run, but apparently didn’t think he could and went for the bomb.
My point exactly.
He could’ve refused to carry the nuke, or taken Guren Seitan into battle since the OS had been broken open enough to let Cecile add pretty pictures to the OS. He also could’ve ordered someone to kill him indirectly, if he was truly intent on suicide.
Also valid input. He walked out with a loaded WMD, if he was really morally opposed to killing, he could’ve sortied without it.
In the end, ten million people suffered for the ‘oops’ with the bomb. And, as far as the Elevens are concerned, Suzaku fired the bomb willingly on his own people – whether he ‘wanted’ to or not doesn’t matter; the only difference here is whether he goes emo over killing everyone in Tokyo or goes emo because he’s busy blaming Lulu for what he did.
Great insight. Especially the end bit.
@Maipeisu
Attempting neither to defend or condemn Bombzaku, allow me to point out that the ‘command’ geass appears to function by rearranging a person’s neural pathways, not by rewriting them entirely. Note the brain-through-the-iris animation sequences. Lulu’s geass cannot force a person to perform an action that is beyond their capability or conceptualization. To my knowledge, no such attempt has ever been made in the series, save for Lulu’s command to a dying Shirley, which, ruling out the potentially nullifying effects of the geass canceler, likely failed because it was an impossible instruction to fulfill. This implies that Suzuka was not stretching his imagination when he opted to deploy FLEIA as a last resort. To him, it was a possibility, and a viable one at that. I do not subscribe to the Power of Suggestion (courtesy of Ms. Batshit) argument, because Suzuka had a good long while to contemplate the detonation of the warhead and its consequences for the Tokyo Settlement’s denizens. The point here is that he considered it as a possible solution to his dilemma, weighing the lives of millions against the opportunity capture/punish/kill Zero in one fell swoop. That, more than anything else, vividly portrays Suzaku’s unstable mentality.
Incredible. Absolutely incredible viewpoint. I’ll be looking at your posts more closely from now on. You raise a valid point that the Geass doesn’t force you to do something you simply cannot do.
It’s ironic how no one brings up the point that Suzaku brought out a WMD in the middle of a fight that was bordering an active city. That alone should tell you what his character is. Sunrise has recently been flirting with the idea of Suzaku being as morally ambiguous as Lelouch, treading down that pathway slowly and I think this exemplifies it perfectly.
What I am really curious about here is how geass’ origins and the Black Knights’ battle for supremacy will plot-converge in the end. Lulu seems so obsessed with retrieving Nunnally that I cannot imagine how his efforts will ultimately position him to deal with Charles.
I think Nunnally’s removal from the CG world really frees Lelouch to act as viciously as he wants to. All his efforts to topple Britannia up til now have been hampered by Lelouch’s concern for Nunnally’s safety. With Nunnally out of the way we’re going to see a whole new Lelouch that might actually be on par with Charles and may even exceed Schneizel on the battlefield.
That’s what I’m looking forward to. How the “new” Lelouch will far against his final boss father. The only possible impediment to Lelouch embracing his darker nature may be Kallen as his emotional connection to her may serve as a lingering anchor keeping him from descending into despotic megalomania.
@the last few posts regarding bombzaku (too lazy too look for quotes you’ll know what I’m talking about)
Ok it’s Suzaku’s fault for one simple reason you don’t go into battle with a weapon you say you’re not going to use, but he couldn’t leave it on the ship the ship you have to consider Nina which is why Suzaku took it to keep it away from Nina (that’s what I think it’s the only logical thing I can think of) But his mistake was not defusing it knowing that his geass to live on could’ve activated so you see it’s really Suzaku’s fault for being a retard and not taking into consideration the posible outcomes of battle like Lelouch, Lelouch only does something after analyzing every other posible choice unlike Suzaku who’s plot armor allows him to go into a gun fight with a tiny knife and come out alive, that’s Jesus powers to ya.
There is no posible way you can blame this on Lelouch I mean really how the hell was he suppose to know a year ago that Suzaku would hold a nuke and in his last moments fire it because of that command really????? Besides he considered Suzaku’s move a bluff (which it was but he didn’t know that there really was a Nuke).
Many of you have already said it but Suzaku is just an emo who can’t kill himself that’s all and all he wants is to leave this world to atone for his “sins” which is stupid because it doesn’t resolve anything. Yet another thing wrong with Suzaku is his idea that he can actually make a difference from withing please so what you’re going to save a thousand people after Britannia makes you kill Millions of others? Remember a whole year passed Suzaku running wild in the world in his inmorortal Lancelot kicking whoevers ass was crazy enough to fight Britania (we all know only Zero can do it)
So whoever of you who was defending Suzaku tell me how has he not earned one of these nicknames:
Drugzaku, Spinzaku, Moralfagzaku, Bombzaku, Masacrezaku, Emozaku, Idiotzaku, Fagzaku, If I’m missing one I’m sorry I’m tired I will post tommorrow if anyone posts.
Also this will be in everyone of my posts until it happens
DEATH TO ROLO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
cuz I really hate him
cj: Some responsibility rests on Lulu’s shoulders because he had several opportunities to take care of the “live” Geass… and he has had access to Orange-kun’s Geass Canceller for several episodes. If he was wanting Suzaku to die, he could’ve arranged for it by allowing Rolo to do away with Suzaku way back when. If he wanted to remove the Geass, he could’ve done so even during this episode. Plus there’s the whole ‘Suzaku blames Lulu for Euphie’s death’ thing to deal with… and knowing that Suzaku had willingly murdered his dad to end the Britannia/Japan war would suggest that Suzaku could do something rather… bad. Even if he didn’t know about FLEIJA, he knew Suzaku well enough to have gambled on the One Million Zeroes tactic working. That, and for setting up the battle to happen where it did also meant that lives were being put at risk.
Suzaku was the guy who, in the end, pulled the trigger. But Lulu has had chances to stop Suzaku before the bomb was pulled… and didn’t, because he believed in his friendship with Suzaku as well as the latter’s decency. Unfortunately, Suzaku’s instability and the “live” Geass overrode those other factors, resulting in him detonating the FREIJA bomb practically in Nunnally’s face. However, Lulu was also STUPID enough to send Rolo-the-Unstable-Killer to rescue his sister, so obviously his judgement has been suffering for the past few episodes anyways.
But, at least Suzaku’s lived up to the Massacre Princess’ legacy – she only managed to kill a few thousand Elevens, and he topped that easy.
Wow. You all need to get a grip and remember that this is JUST FICTION (and I edit its articles on wikipedia, but geez, we don’t write essays back and forth during a disagreement). The main point to remember always is that events happen only because the writers want them to. Yes, he could have not fired the bomb, but that wouldn’t have been nearly as exciting, would it? We all knew as soon as she entrusted it to him that this would happen, yet you’re all writing essays back and forth about why it shouldn’t have. Get a grip, and try directing that energy into the schoolwork that statistically most of you have.
Sayokooooooooooooooooo!!! T_T
ok, sorry, but I just love her, she’s so damn sexy xD
I’m just worried Kallen will go over to Gino … that would suck bigtime
Sorry Halycon and Cj, but you two are just fucking crazy. Blaming Suzaku even though HE WAS UNDER CONTROL OF THE GEASS (hence Lelouch’s fault) is beyond retarded.
I’ve never seen such blind fanboys with the most stupid, illogical arguments ever made.
Who’s fault?
Lelouch
Nina
Suzaku
Kallen
Brittania
Black knights
Nana-chan
@goob
Sorry Halycon and Cj, but you two are just fucking crazy. Blaming Suzaku even though HE WAS UNDER CONTROL OF THE GEASS (hence Lelouch’s fault) is beyond retarded.
Read Maipeisu’s reply as it nullifies any argument that Lelouch could be at fault for Suzaku’s actions.
Firstly, The Geass Command cannot force you to do something you’re incapable of doing. Suzaku was capable of vaporizing millions of people, hence he did so.
Secondly, the Geass Command was for Suzaku to survive, not to kill.
Thirdly, it was Suzaku’s own choice to go out to war, in the middle of a city, armed with a WMD.
Fourthly, Suzaku pulled the trigger, not Lelouch!
That whole Nuremburg Defense (as I’ve stated earlier) does not hold up because of the simple fact that his Geass Command did not force him to kill anyone, unlike Euphie’s Command. His Geass Command only forces him to save himself, it doesn’t make a choice of how he should accomplish that. That is up to Suzaku.
I’ve never seen such blind fanboys with the most stupid, illogical arguments ever made.
I’ve yet to see anyone point out a single flaw in my statement.
Your only rebuttals thus far have been “but..but… he was Geass’d!! The Geass told him to kill millions of his own people”.
To which I have replied (with facts) that no, his Geass commands him to Survive, not to kill.
At any rate, was it his Geass that forced Suzaku to take AIM at the government center in the direction of his own troops instead of Zero or the Ikaruga?
No, that was pure Suzaku baby.
For all “OMG GEASS MADE HIM DO IT” arguments, please read Maipeisu’s post as it is the most brilliantly constructed reply on this topic.
And so we finally have the Nuke Episode! So who’s to blame? Both of them like always.
Suzaku: Pulled the tigger, wasn’t able to fight the Geass like his precious Euphy, didn’t refuse the mission on principle, didn’t figure out a way to fire the nuke off into the ocean as a warning against the Black Knights or something
Lulu: Geassed Mr. Suicidal to live thus causing many of these issues, wrote Suzaku’s threat off and didn’t take it seriously, told Kallen to have at him despite knowing about the Live On Geass
On Lulu, those last two, I would argue, make Lulu just as responsible. I mean, Lulu knows that Suzaku would do anything to stay alive due to the Live Geass, was told by Suzaku he had a friggin’ nuke, and despite all that ordered Kallen to create such a situation as to lead Suzaku to pull the trigger against his better judgement. His strategy abilities must have been set to Off this episode not only to send Rollo in for Nunally but to ignore the White Reaper’s nuke talk.
But darn it Suzaku! Learn from Lulu and try and THINK THING THROUGH!
Anyways, poor Kallen. Complete loyalty, awesome piloting, and snapping Lulu in line occasionally leads only to being Priority #3 -.-
@everyone against me and Halcyon
Firsto of all I’m am no Lelouch fanboy, he’s just the only character that has (I believe) the best plan of action in the series. I still believe that other things should be done before going for an all out rebellion which really only causes more chaos but I’m not going to explain my theory right now. I agree with what Halcyon said I mean really how the hell is LIVE ON mean shoot a bomb in the middle of the air and run away it was far more easier to just run PERIOD why did he need to fire the bomb then? Becuase by his retarded logic the bomb increases his chances of survival -_- really shooting bombs close too you allows you to survive more? That is really interesting now I know what to do if I go to war just throw granades around and run because the grenade draws the attention away from me …….. Also you really can’t say that because of live on Suzaku would react like that I mean that means he’s inmortal because the geass will save his life every time WRONG the Geass can’t make you do something that you aren’t physically able to do which means that it wasn’t the geass that saved him but Suzaku’s Jesus powers and ability to bend physics in a way that makes his knightmare faster and stronger than eveyone else’s. I mean the broken KNF was still faster than Kallen which doesn’t make sense because a few seconds ago it was getting badly owned. Lelouch knows the geass is in effect but still believed kallen was good enough a pilot to defeat his Jesus powers. You can say that it was a miscalculation on Lelouch’s part and he tends to make them when all emo and demonic (and all around sentimental) but most of the fault lies with Suzaku’s lack of planning I mean (dare I say it) he’s very close to reaching Tamaki’s level of being able to plan things out.
@westrim
I know that the real ones at fault are the writers but writing these essays is just the thing to kill boredom it’s quite enjoyable after a while; at first I was like you ^.^
Thinking things over, Suzaku probably COULDN’T have run – or at least, not run and escaped Guren Seitan thanks to its Wings of Light. Of course, Kallen’s now got to bear the guilt for merely playing with Suzaku instead of killing him immediately the way she could’ve with her flying radiation fist or other weapons. Of course, now everything with 8000m/5 miles of the government building’s been bombed… even if the bomb only took a 1300m-radius circle around the government building, due to the ‘up to 3000m super blast from void drag’ effect’ and the unspecified 5000m-8000m effect radius.
I think if Nunnally dies, I hope she dies in the hands of Suzaku… but I don’t want her to die.
Lol Those acronyms are made up anyways… right?